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Post by Envie on Apr 19, 2017 6:39:24 GMT -5
Re-Watch Date: Wednesday, April 19th, 2017. HBO Viewer's Guide Page: viewers-guide.hbo.com/game-of-thrones/season-5/episode-4Runtime: 51 minutes Original Release date: May 3rd, 2015 Jorah Mormont sets sail alongside his prisoner, Tyrion. Cersei makes a move against the Tyrells. Jaime and Bronn sneak into Dorne. Ellaria and the Sand Snakes make their plans. Melisandre tempts Jon. The Harpies attack.
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Post by izzue on Apr 19, 2017 18:11:26 GMT -5
Setting us up for Shireen's fate - that Selyse didn't want to bring her with them and the story of how much Stannis loved Shireen so he searched all of Westeros for a Maester that could cure her. Also serves as a set-up for Jorah finding a cure S7, or at least something to arrest the spread, as happened with Shireen. So much about Rhaegar. The beautiful story of Rhaegar going out to sing to the people, that he didn't like killing, he liked to sing - such a contrast to Baristan's tale last episode about the abomination that Aerys became at the end. A beautiful rendering of The Tourney at Harrenhal, even if delivered by LF, and so so many clues. I had forgotten that LF had told Sansa that if she could hang in till Stannis ran the Boltons out of WF that she, the last surviving Stark, would be Wardenness of the North. I kept thinking of the last scene in the episode of S6 when Jon was declared King in the North. One of my all-time favorite lines, when Margaery fumed to Tommen that Cersei had had Loras arrested to get back at her for 'taking Tommen away' ... Poor Tommen: "Aren't you and Mother getting along?" And Tommen at the Sept - so sad. I can't wait to see the Jorah and Tyrion duo continued next episode. Always loved that. Two definitely revolting scenes - Melisandre trying to seduce Jon (man, does she want that king's blood!) and LF kissing Sansa.
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Post by alcasinoroyale on Apr 20, 2017 0:28:34 GMT -5
While I consider to be one of the weaker episodes of S5, here are some things that I liked: * Sansa finding Robert's feather at Lyanna's Tomb was a nice callback to S1. * Dany and Barristan talking about Rhaegar. It showcased the genuine and tender side of Dany, but also offers an interesting hint about Rhaegar's personality that he was admirable and compassionate. * Jon and Mel. She does bring up an interesting subject about Life vs. Death. Jon is tempted here, but still has Ygritte on his mind. Something intriguing that Mel says though is "This power in you, you resist it, and that's your mistake. Embrace it." Mel obviously has an interest in Jon and it's more than trying to be sexual, so this definitely foreshadows how she sees him as The Prince Who Was Promised later on. * Jaime looking at Tarth. At least he's thinking about Brienne while being sent to shitty Dorne. * Stannis and Shireen. Now looking back at this, while it feels kind of eerie, knowing what's coming, I still think this is the most open we've seen Stannis. He talks about how he called in every master to save his daughter because he loves her and as izzue said it sets up hope for Jorah that maybe his greyscale could be cured. * Cersei pretty much giving no fucks about restoring the faith militant, even though it will come back to haunt her. As for what I didn't enjoy: * Barristan dying. I've probably criticized this a lot by this point, but I still think he went out too early. It's a cool fight scene to a certain extent, but I feel like there was more left here. I wanted to see him lead the Unsullied against the Yunkish and potentially have a heroic death there, because at least we would have seen him fight in battle, but it's too late for that. But I guess he did get that one last scene with Dany, still doesn't make up for it though. * Dorne and Obara's Monologue. Perfect Example why Jaime should have went to the Riverlands instead. * Littlefinger telling the story of Harrenhal seemed strange to me, but I guess there's not many in the show left alive who could have brought it up. It makes me almost wish that Meera had talked about it back in S3.
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Syrax
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Post by nikma on Apr 20, 2017 9:34:14 GMT -5
I really liked Jaime's scenes with Bronn in this episode. The fight scene in Dorne was very interesting as well.
I liked the scenes in KL this episode. Cersei's scene with HS was short but effective.
And the first scene between Jorah and Tyrion was great.
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Post by dje on Apr 20, 2017 19:28:00 GMT -5
This is one of the slower episodes of S5, but it sets up a lot. All the stuff with the Faith Militant, Cersei thinking she is in control, but setting her own downfall up as well. I hated Ser Barristan dying,I always thought he would die in Meereen (in the book anyway), but I do think he went out to early. I loved Jon turning down Melisandre.
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Post by katjushka on Apr 20, 2017 23:17:58 GMT -5
Finally getting round to this.. Cersei being her own, smug self is a beautiful thing to watch. She seems to have everyone under her thumb and she knows it. Except she's wrong. The rise of the faith militant is well captured in a few scenes. Poor Tommen trying to be king. I like Bronn, I like Jamie and Bronn I wish they weren't on their way to Dorne though But the short chat about Tyrion in the beginning and Jaime looking at Tarth are very nice. The scene with Jon doing lord commander stuff and Sam being his secretary is nice, I miss those two together. Mel offering her body to Jon, convincing him there's "No magic, no visions" made me laugh knowing the truth about her now I'd say there's a tiny bit of magic involved there.. It's hard to look at Shireen, knowing she was just a pawn, brought to the wall just to be burned Really hard to like Mel here.. A very nice scene with her and Stannis though. LF is such a creep and I hate that it's him who tells the story of the tourney but I'm also really glad that we got that story. Tyrion makes a friend in Jorah
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Post by Lady Sansa's Direwolf on Apr 21, 2017 19:59:14 GMT -5
In re=examining these episodes, this does not stand out as one of the best of season 5
Pros: Dany and Barristan's final scene. I'm glad Dany got to hear about Rhaegar from someone who really knew and respected the prince. Jorah and Tyrion: one of the best partnerships of the show. Great traveling companions.
Pros that are also Cons: Shireen: sorry guys, I'm never going to be reconciled. See her again, listening to her father's story of how much he loves her, brutal foreshadowing. Sansa: again, not a fan of the decision to go north.
Cons: Jamie and Bronn Go to Dorne. 'nough said
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Envie
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Post by Envie on Apr 22, 2017 15:21:14 GMT -5
I'm doing my two episodes on Saturday thing again this week to catch up! I understand why some people vote this episode much lower, but aside from Barristan Selmy's poorly done death (way too soon and not as heroic as it should have been) I found this episode to be another quieter moment of foreboding doom to come. I think it's the depressing nature of this episode's foreshadowing that likely has it lowest on the scale of favorite episodes in Season 5. There were certainly a lot of sad moments being foretold to come ... let's take a look: 1. Shireen & Stannis - Where I enjoyed seeing the impending future for some characters in their poor choices, this one punches you right in the guts in re-watching because I remember so well thinking this tender moment between the typically unemotional Stannis and his sweet daughter meant something good. Instead, it meant terrible things to come later ... 2. Tommen & Margaery - Tommen's honeymoon is suddenly over and the sweet innocent boy is thrust in the middle of a battle he can't possibly ever win, even as the king. This was a sad moment when we realized he was going to be a casualty between Cersei and Margaery for sure ... When the commonfolk began calling him a "bastard" and "abomination" and he failed to reach the High Sparrow and demand Loras be released, I knew he was doomed just not when, or how. 3. Littlefinger's Brothel Destroyed - While not in itself a horrible thing (you deserve it Littlefinger), this was a foreboding moment because here we saw Olyvar realize he's also caught in a trap and he'll turn on Ser Loras to get out of it. The Sparrows are also so over the top you feel bad for the whores and patrons. Proof that fanaticism is definitely the opposite of what most religions aim for in moral teachings and how flawed humans are on both sides of this issue that plagues our own real world too. 4. Grey Worm & Barristan go down - Definitely not a hero's battle at all. It sucked, let's just admit it and hate it together. They went down in a back alley fighting against a bunch of masked goons who tricked them. This isn't even good comic book super-hero material. Barristan should have died defending Daenerys - at least in the fighting pit scene to come. Not this way! ... I truly did hate this scene ... To try and combat my strong dislike for this scene, I'll throw in there that at least he and Dany had a tender moment just before that and we got yet another clue about Rhaegar ... "Rhaegar never liked killing ... " 5. The Sandsnakes - Our first introduction didn't go so well ... I mean what more can I say? It started weak with them and just went on and on for the doomed Dorne story. And the "Grumpy Cat" of Westeros has arrived on the scene: But for every negative there's always a positive in Game of Thrones. That's why I love this show. It always manages to impress me despite areas I wasn't crazy about. Here's my favorite bits from this episode: 1. Cersei cleaning up the small council - Sending Mace off to Braavos and the Iron Bank. Only old Pycelle left to go! (Your Days are Numbered Pycelle...) 2. Sansa & Littlefinger in the Winterfell Crypts - I know lots of folks here didn't like that LF got to deliver the story of the Tourney at Harenhal story, but I actually loved it. Who better to tell the real story than one of the biggest liars in the story? This is probably the first time we see that hint of 'something more' to the story from someone who normally masks his true feelings so well. Littlefinger just let the cat right out of the bag here my friends... I saw it coming a mile away! Sansa: "Yes he chose her. And then he kidnapped her and raped her..."3. Jon Snow manages to resist the temptress Melisandre (much to konradsmith 's disapproval ) but she lets the boy know he's got it all wrong: 4. We learn Jaime does have feelings for Brienne - ever so briefly we see some emotion. At least his trip down to Dorne was worth this much! "Tarth, Ser Jaime..."5. My favorite story arc this season begins now ... The misadventures of Tyrion and Ser Jorah!The two exiles on their way to meet the Dragon Queen!
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konradsmith
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Post by konradsmith on Apr 23, 2017 1:58:37 GMT -5
Qyburn's such a kind fellow to laugh at Mace the Ace's joke about giving his regards the Titan of Braavos. Fitting since both men are GODS AMONGST MERE MORTALS.
Qyburn's just the best generally. Anton Lesser gives him such a dry wit. Which adds a lot to the characters as written. I mean it's one thing to pull off GrrM's version of Dr. Frankenstein meets Mengele but to make the part funny in addition to everything else...now that takes a great actor.
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Post by konradsmith on Apr 23, 2017 2:20:16 GMT -5
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Post by konradsmith on Apr 23, 2017 2:34:51 GMT -5
"You know nothing Jon Snow" indeed. What a weenie-boy. Given such an opportunity and he denies it because of Ygritte's memory? Really? Seriously? This wee feller's priorities are so out of whack it's not even worth getting into. I guess he didn't deserve the chance in the first place. MeliJondre was nothing more than a dream, it seems.
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Post by konradsmith on Apr 23, 2017 2:55:35 GMT -5
Enter Rosabell.
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Envie
Vhagar
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Post by Envie on Apr 24, 2017 13:04:14 GMT -5
Something I completely forgot to mention that was a pretty big moment in this episode ... A telling scene between Stannis and Selyse as Stannis is watching Jon Snow sparring in the courtyard with the recruits: Selyse: "You think highly of this boy?" Stannis: "Lord Commander of the Night's Watch." Selyse: "And a bastard by some tavern slut." Stannis: "Perhaps, but that wasn't Ned Stark's way."It's really too bad Stannis didn't survive because he was about the best chance Jon Snow had at the time to rally more men to the cause of fighting the White Walkers. Stannis gave him ships to go to Hardhome and Stannis believed Jon could also unite the wildlings to fight with him as well. Stannis was completely certain about Cersei and Jaime's kids and that lie and I believe he was fairly certain Jon Snow was not Ned's bastard if a bastard at all. A man of truth.
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Post by Lady Sansa's Direwolf on Apr 24, 2017 18:55:16 GMT -5
Stannis was completely certain about Cersei and Jaime's kids and that lie and I believe he was fairly certain Jon Snow was not Ned's bastard if a bastard at all. A man of truth. I've often wondered what other people in Westeros thought of Jon Snow's parentage. Robert, of course, never questioned it because Robert was a horn dog himself, but others knew Ned as an honorable man who wouldn't sleep around with just any old tavern wench. Who did they think Jon's mother was? Did any ever put two and two together with Lyanna's abduction and death? It's obvious here that Stannis thought there was more to the situation than Ned revealed.
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Envie
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Post by Envie on Apr 25, 2017 6:47:54 GMT -5
Stannis was completely certain about Cersei and Jaime's kids and that lie and I believe he was fairly certain Jon Snow was not Ned's bastard if a bastard at all. A man of truth. I've often wondered what other people in Westeros thought of Jon Snow's parentage. Robert, of course, never questioned it because Robert was a horn dog himself, but others knew Ned as an honorable man who wouldn't sleep around with just any old tavern wench. Who did they think Jon's mother was? Did any ever put two and two together with Lyanna's abduction and death? It's obvious here that Stannis thought there was more to the situation than Ned revealed. If you think about it from a realistic perspective, there had to be other people who knew aside from Howand Reed because we know there were attendants at Lyanna's birth (whether they were handmaidens or just servants or midwives we don't know) and there had to be a wetnurse at some point as well since Ned would have had to find someone to feed Jon immediately or he would have died. Of course those little details are skipped in the book, Ned doesn't focus on that part of it and we never hear about it. But people talk, especially the commoners. They would have likely told someone of the tragic death of Lyanna and Ned Stark taking her baby north with him. Someone in the south most likely since that's where they were at the time. Then there's that side trip Ned took to return Dawn to House Dayne which still remains a mystery. My guess is there were rumors galore about Ned's bastard right from the start, but they were just rumors by the time he got north with Jon and of course he forbid anyone talking about it up there so that ended that. With Stannis at Dragonstone, and back and forth to his brother's court, it would not surprise me at all if the rumors had reached him there as well. After all, he knew (and believed) the rumors about Cersei and Jaime. Everyone knew about Ser Loras and Renly too. Secrets don't really stay secrets much around King's Landing. Only because Robert was king and refused to believe anything other than the kidnapping story he himself made up did the rumor stay buried and the truth about Jon stayed a secret.
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