Envie
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Post by Envie on May 25, 2017 5:01:08 GMT -5
((Hi Guys, sorry for the late posting on this episode - the Season 7 Trailer was released on this same day and the episode Re-watch got forgotten a bit in all our excitement!  ... We'll all catch up on the episodes by this weekend I'm sure))
Re-Watch Date: Wednesday, May 24th, 2017
HBO Viewer's Guide Page: viewers-guide.hbo.com/game-of-thrones/season-6/episode-4Runtime: 59 minutes Original Release date: May 15th, 2016 Sansa arrives at Castle Black.
Tyrion makes a deal with the Slave Masters.
Jorah and Daario sneak into Vaes Dothrak.
Ramsay sends a letter to Jon.
Theon arrives at Pyke.
Cersei and Olenna Tyrell plot against the High Sparrow.
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TheMadQueen
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Post by TheMadQueen on May 25, 2017 11:04:13 GMT -5
So good.
Dany and Dothraki is always great. Her bonding with the other Khaleesi was cute. And finally, her big scene. Still one of my favorites of all scenes ever. I just love how she steps out of the fire and they all bow. Ugh. So good.
Kings Landing was solid. The High Sparrow uses his kindly old man game on Margaery, but she is Lady Olenna reborn. She sees right through it, and begs Loras to stay strong. Loras looks like hell, and is at his breaking point.
I forgot how hilarious the moment when Pycelle leaves is. It takes him like 15 seconds to walk across the room, and Cersei is just staring at him. It's pretty funny. Cersei guilts Tommen into giving her info, which she then brings to the Small Council. Though she hates Cersei, Olenna is all in if it means sparing Marg from humiliation. They win over Kevan, and plan to strike the High Sparrow before he can hurt another Queen.
Jon and Sansa reuniting was beautiful. The music is great. Tormunds seductive chicken eating was funny. The agreeing to take back winterfell was good.
I liked how this episode brought Tyrion down a couple notches. Idk about anybody else, but I think he handled those negotiations pretty badly. He was trying to use his Season 2 ways of bribing and sweet talking. It wasn't really working, 7 years is life and death to many slaves. I really enjoyed watching Grey Worm and Missandei tell him how much he sucks. His arrogance was really apparent.
Yara was too hard on Theon, but I can see why. In addition to tough love, Theon also did show up at a very suspicious time. Yara is already annoyed that she has to go through the Kingsmoot at all, and then the heir shows up? She has the right to be a lil shook.
Littlefinger's stunt with the falcon and getting Royce the Voice to basically grovel to a child was great. We all talk shit on Littlefinger, but he is a great manipulator. He got a complete reversal of power in that dynamic in like 45 seconds.
No Arya this week was a blessing.
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Post by Deleted on May 25, 2017 11:17:01 GMT -5
I love this one too. I know some thought the Dany burning the Khals scene was a little clunky, but there's no denying how powerful the image of her walking out of the fire and seeing 100k+ bow to her was. Shit gives me chills.
And then there's the Jon/Sansa reunion. Until Hodor's death this was the scene that choked me up the most. The music, the hug, great stuff.
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katjushka
Drogon
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Post by katjushka on May 26, 2017 0:04:47 GMT -5
Oh my, that reunion kills me everytime  I was so afraid that there's gonna be another near miss and they won't meet but yaaas! Brienne meeting Davos and Mel is also great  And meeting Tormund, of course  I feel the Meereen scenes and Tyrions slight fuck up is sort of there to show us that there really is no good way to handle the situation, diplomacy doesn't really work any better than using force as Dany did. Maybe we'll also see parallels of this once they get to Westeros and Tyrion actually knows how to handle people there better and it's Dany, Missandei and Grey worm who are learning along the way. I forgot how hilarious the moment when Pycelle leaves is. It takes him like 15 seconds to walk across the room, and Cersei is just staring at him. This is hilarious I love Dany's big moment, be it cliche, be it predictable or repetative, be it what ever.. It's epic to me. |
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Post by Deleted on May 26, 2017 8:16:37 GMT -5
This is actually one of my favourite episodes, because S5 got a lot of criticism for the way they portrayed female characters and this episode marked the return of feminist GoT. Feminism and the portrayal of female characters in fiction is something that has always been important to me (I grew up in a household with six women who all have very strong personalities ). This episode knocks it out of the park with regard to that. We have Sansa for the first time ever dominating a scene all by herself, especially against a male character (not counting her scenes with Theon here, because she was not really dominating her scenes as much as she was just desperate back then). Jon and Sansa have a heartfelt conversation at first, but then there is a tonal shift when Sansa confronts him with her intent to retake Winterfell from the Boltons. Jon is war-weary and he doesn't want to fight anymore, which is understandable. But Sansa urges him to fight for their home. The fact that she is the dominant one in this scene is emphasised by the camera and by the way the characters are positioned. Sansa stands up and Jon remains seated. Through a low-angle-shot, we see Jon in the front and Sansa talking to him in the background. She literally “talks down” to him, which illustrates that she is the dominant character in this scene. She tries to reason with him and does not back down when he eventually stands up and confronts her face-to-face. Sansa holds her ground for the first time ever. I know some people interpreted this negatively, because they don't want Jon to seem "weak". But let's not forget that Jon was really fragile, tired and depressed from what had just happened to him. Also, after what had happened to her in S5, Sansa deserved this moment. Margaery, Olenna, Cersei, Yara and Melisandre all had very good scenes as well. Margaery and Yara also dominate the scenes with their brothers just like Sansa did with Jon. This episode showed sisters being stronger than their brothers. And then of course Dany happened. Seeing naked Dany walking out of that burning hut, having just destroyed an entire patriarchy was amazing. Her naked body is not sexualised here at all. The female body is not the object of the male gaze, instead it becomes a symbol of power. Absolutely brilliant. This episode is a 10/10 for me. |
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Post by Lady Sansa's Direwolf on May 26, 2017 10:08:38 GMT -5
This episode should have been subtitled, "Sisters are doing it for themselves."
First we have the reunion. When Jon sees his sister, grown and alive in front of him, that step back he takes says so much. While he is depressed, fragile, newly reborn and uncertain of his life's purpose, suddenly the gods have delivered to him something to believe in again, someone to protect, who is his only connection still unbroken to the life he had before the NW's treason. Jon is a hero who needs that, needs a reason to go on another day. But here comes a living breathing reason to carry on, perhaps a reason while the Red god sent him back. Sansa, after everything she's endured, takes his weakness and makes it her strength. She takes on the role she was born to play, Lady of Winterfell. Through her adversity she's become a true blend of Ned and Catelyn, Northern Steel, ready to take back what is hers. The power shift is subtle but the Lady wins her Knight's service. I can see how people can confuse this with something else, but no, the love between these two is familial only.
I love how Jon again uses the "I've fought, and I lost" excuse twice, once with Sansa and once with Ser Davos. Neither let him get away with it, telling him to get over it and move forward. Without them, he would be lost.
Poor Sweet Robin. I wonder if we will hear anything further from the Lord of the Vale, or if he just hangs out behind the action while the winter comes. While he will never be a great lord, he's just a victim of Lysa's madness. Littlefinger schooling Royce, again manipulating the facts to suit his purpose, is great. I don't like the character but you have to admit he's good at what he does.
I agree that the negotiations shows Tyrion's shortcomings. He has no experience in dealing with men who deal in flesh, and the difficulty in attempting to work with men who see humans as figures on a ledger. As the USA would discover, there is no peaceable solution to ending slavery. I dislike more the attempts by Tyrion to make friends with Missandei and Grey Worm. Ok, I get that he is attempting to broaden their horizons but this is a culture vastly different from Westeros, the rules are not the same as what he grew up playing by.
The travels of Joran and Daario is amusing, Daario ribbing Jorah about how Dany acts in bed. This entire part in Vaes Dothrak is amazing. From Dany's conversations with the older widows (I hope you stay with us, the alternative isn't so pretty), to befriending the young widow with promises of dragons. These truly are the people a Targaryen needs to conquer to world. Dany's rebirth (again) through the flames as the khals pay for their arrogance with their lives. Dany buys her life, and the lives of the Dothraki, through their death - again it is the dualism between her and Jon (his in snow, hers through fire).
One of the best episodes of the entire series as far as I am concerned.
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Post by dje on May 26, 2017 23:16:34 GMT -5
I agree with you all, very powerful episode. My favorite part is the Jon/Sansa reunion. And the scenes in Vaes Dothrak are perfect, also, LF doing what he does, great episode.
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Envie
Vhagar
"If I look back I am lost."
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Post by Envie on May 27, 2017 21:34:39 GMT -5
This episode should have been subtitled, "Sisters are doing it for themselves." First we have the reunion. When Jon sees his sister, grown and alive in front of him, that step back he takes says so much. While he is depressed, fragile, newly reborn and uncertain of his life's purpose, suddenly the gods have delivered to him something to believe in again, someone to protect, who is his only connection still unbroken to the life he had before the NW's treason. Jon is a hero who needs that, needs a reason to go on another day. But here comes a living breathing reason to carry on, perhaps a reason while the Red god sent him back. Sansa, after everything she's endured, takes his weakness and makes it her strength. She takes on the role she was born to play, Lady of Winterfell. Through her adversity she's become a true blend of Ned and Catelyn, Northern Steel, ready to take back what is hers. The power shift is subtle but the Lady wins her Knight's service. I can see how people can confuse this with something else, but no, the love between these two is familial only. I love how Jon again uses the "I've fought, and I lost" excuse twice, once with Sansa and once with Ser Davos. Neither let him get away with it, telling him to get over it and move forward. Without them, he would be lost. Bravo! Well Said!  I was going to do one of my gif reviews of this episode but decided instead to focus on the strong start and finish in this episode only. I couldn't have said it nearly as well as you did my friend and it's so true, Sansa's shift from pawn to Queen was swift and glorious and she deserves a spot in the Season 7 power-play every bit as much as Jon Snow in my opinion. I do get it why some fans were quite annoyed that Sansa took a back seat to Jon later on but I don't think it's as bad as everyone's making it out to be and it certainly isn't lessening her value as Lady of Winterfell. Jon's weak here in this episode. He just wants to run off and disappear somewhere. He's been to the other side and back and doesn't see much of a point in fighting anymore. Sansa, on the other hand, has been to the bottom of her own struggle but rises back to the top when she finally makes it to Jon. She gives him strength where he had none left. She's been through hell and she's not going to just give up at this point. She escaped the monster and now she's ready to defeat him even knowing it will cost Rickon his life (she already knew he would die because she knows Ramsay well). Jon and Sansa's reunion is a really great opener for this episode as it immediately puts you in high spirits and ready to cheer on the good-guys again. The King's Landing and Meereen stories, which aren't particularly that great, are carried along on this high because we know in both stories, something bigger is coming and these players in the game (the small council and Tyrion's council) are just biding time until we get to that point. And then there's that huge climactic ending. Wow, what a way to ride the wave of fist pumping satisfaction that things are really turning around for everyone! We all knew Dany would figure something out and I'm SO glad they took the story this way instead of having her rescued (again) by Drogon! I remember the spoiler filming for Season 6 for this scene had me somewhat bummed out that the dragons weren't going to be involved. I thought it was going to be underwhelming or lame... but damn. I was wrong there! That's why we shouldn't judge spoilers/leaks for Season 7 because you can really never tell what the finished product is going to look like even when you see spoiler photos from the filming. It always looks cheesy from the outside! Daenerys managing to defeat the Khals all by herself and emerge from the temple completely unharmed was an amazing moment. Where Jon's defying death was cold, quiet and sad ... Dany's was on fire, literally! So the two opposites are once again paralleled in their ever turning cycle of life and death. It was here many fans (who didn't read the books) finally began to realize who the song of ice and fire is really about ...  |
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izzue
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Post by izzue on May 27, 2017 23:32:10 GMT -5
The Pink Letter -- It was "Your brother Rickon is in my dungeon" that brought the reading of the letter, and Jon, and Sansa, to a painful standstill. Then -- "His direwolf's skin is on my floor. Come and see. I want my bride back . . . Keep her from me and I will ride North and slaughter every wildling man, woman, and babe living under your protection. You will watch as I skin them living," and Jon stops. Sansa says "Go on" and takes the letter from him, continues reading. "You will watch as my soldiers take turns raping your sister. You will watch as my dogs devour your wild little brother. Then I will spoon your eyes from their sockets and let my dogs do the rest. Come and See. Ramsay Bolton, Lord of Winterfell and Warden of the North." Ramsay's 5,000. Tormund's 2,000. Jon looks to Sansa with such a painful, almost pleading look. All of the "bastard" labels jumping out of the Pink Letter, together with being assassinated by his own men . . . Jon has slipped back into his 'place' as "bastard", 'less than' all the other [full-blooded] Stark kids. And that's where I see Sansa shine as I never have before -- she puts it right on the line with, "You are the son of the last true Warden of the North. Northern families are loyal, they'll fight for you is you ask." When Jon still hesitates, she reaches over and forcibly grabs his hand, "A monster has taken over our home and our brother. We have to go back to Winterfell and save them both." And there's Edd looking at Jon at that point, just wishing and willing him to really come back and "be Jon." And he finally nods. I think this is the most powerful scene in the entire episode and that it is where Jon begins to be brought back to life. Mel brought back his breathing and movement, but it's Sansa who's bringing him back to life (even though he's still got far to go). --------------------------------------------------- I could watch over and over again as Dany turns the tables on the khals, turns over the pots of burning oil. The expression on her face while they are insulting and threatening her, knowing what's she's about to do, is priceless. That line that they are not fit to lead, "But I am, so I will." Powerful, beautiful, majestic ending! Theon's return to the Iron Islands - so different from his return when he was sent there by Robb. Made me think of that Robert Frost line "Home is where, when you have to go there, they have to take you in." All of the scenes at the Wall were great, not just the Pink Letter ones above . . . the reunion, that hug between Sansa and Jon is another I could watch over and over. For an episode so full of intense, powerful moments, it's got a lot of humor in it, too. Jorah to Daario, "You didn't get much discipline as a child, did you?" The Pycelle scene TheMadQueen talked about - there was also that "nah nah na nah nah" look he gave Cersei right before he shut the door. In the 'negotiations' with the slavers when Tyrion says they must stop the Sons of the Harpy action and they deny they have anything to do with it, then Tyrion says, "Fine, fine. But you will cut it off all the same." Great episode.
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