freypies
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Post by freypies on Aug 8, 2017 18:10:22 GMT -5
Does anyone else who ventures on reddit's ASOIAF page also feel sometimes that they kind of view the first 4 seasons with rose-tinted glasses and are a little overly nitpicky with current scenes?
I personally felt that all 4 of them had no less problems than the newer ones, especially season 2 which was relatively wonky in how it handled two major characters (Jon and Dany). The Night Lands is also perhaps the worse episode the show has done imo. Also while this Loot Train Battle didn't have anyone prominent die, but so didn't Blackwater, but I never saw anyone complain about that. We get clunky scenes sometimes nowadays, but we got just as many in the seasons previous, which is probably bound to happen with something this big being protrayed on screen.
I know the majority opinion on this season overall is very positive, but I just don't understand how many there are so convinced that the show is a shell of its former self. I personally think that Seasons 6 and 7 (so far) are up there with the very best of Thrones.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2017 18:14:09 GMT -5
I agree, season 6 and 7 are a high point for the show. Season 2 was relatively weak and so were 4 and 5. Still good of course, but 6 and 7 are outstanding.
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Post by King Tommen on Aug 8, 2017 18:19:53 GMT -5
Does anyone else who ventures on reddit's ASOIAF page also feel sometimes that they kind of view the first 4 seasons with rose-tinted glasses and are a little overly nitpicky with current scenes? I personally felt that all 4 of them had no less problems than the newer ones, especially season 2 which was relatively wonky in how it handled two major characters (Jon and Dany). The Night Lands is also perhaps the worse episode the show has done imo. Also while this Loot Train Battle didn't have anyone prominent die, but so didn't Blackwater, but I never saw anyone complain about that. We get clunky scenes sometimes nowadays, but we got just as many in the seasons previous, which is probably bound to happen with something this big being protrayed on screen. I know the majority opinion on this season overall is very positive, but I just don't understand how many there are so convinced that the show is a shell of its former self. I personally think that Seasons 6 and 7 (so far) are up there with the very best of Thrones. My personal opinion is that Blackwater is the most overrated episode on the show. I like it but it doesn't really hold up when you put it up against the other major action/big moment setpieces in later seasons. It is George doing Helm's Deep and it's not even a subtle homage, it's a blatant ripoff.
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jared
Rhaegal
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Post by jared on Aug 8, 2017 19:03:38 GMT -5
Does anyone else who ventures on reddit's ASOIAF page also feel sometimes that they kind of view the first 4 seasons with rose-tinted glasses and are a little overly nitpicky with current scenes? I personally felt that all 4 of them had no less problems than the newer ones, especially season 2 which was relatively wonky in how it handled two major characters (Jon and Dany). The Night Lands is also perhaps the worse episode the show has done imo. Also while this Loot Train Battle didn't have anyone prominent die, but so didn't Blackwater, but I never saw anyone complain about that. We get clunky scenes sometimes nowadays, but we got just as many in the seasons previous, which is probably bound to happen with something this big being protrayed on screen. I know the majority opinion on this season overall is very positive, but I just don't understand how many there are so convinced that the show is a shell of its former self. I personally think that Seasons 6 and 7 (so far) are up there with the very best of Thrones. Yes. And there's a clear reason for that. Because after Season 4 exhausted the lion's share of Martin's best book (ASOS), the show started to forge its own path more confidently, wisely scrapping all but the most essential elements of AFFC & ADWD and eventually surpassing Martin's published work. Because there's such a clear dividing line, the space between Seasons 4 and 5 becomes an easy rallying point for those who are uneasy or upset about the show eclipsing the books in popularity and narrative progression to make their stand, even if the best they can come up with is the boilerplate criticism that "It just doesn't feel the same." Thanks for that, Siskel and Ebert. Two thumbs up. (And for those so inclined, even the first four seasons can be undercut with a cursory "But the books did it better.") The most eye-rolling critique for me in this vein is the claim that the dialogue "just isn't as good as it was when they were following the books". But even when they were following the books more closely, at least half the dialogue in the show was original dialogue from the same writers who are writing the show now. The difference was they were writing those original lines in scenes that people recognized from the books, and mixing in famous lines from the books when appropriate, so the masses had something to latch onto. But woe betide them when "Only Cat" became "Your sister." That was even worse than freestyling in their eyes. Now, there are no more books, so that cover is gone. Most scenes and virtually every line of dialogue have to filter through the prism that "Martin didn't write that", and so the knives and the nitpicks are forever at the ready. For me, as someone who is more emotionally invested in the show than the books, I generally prefer the latter seasons because the production has gotten better at the art of making television every year. The transitions are better. The cinematic language is better. With a higher budget, the visual elements are obviously better. And many of the actors have naturally improved and matured into their roles (others were superb from the jump, and have maintained that level). Season 6 is my favorite season to date, with Season 4 as a close second, and Season 7 has been superb so far (if the last three episodes are as great as the first four, it may wind up surpassing Season 6 in my estimation, even with fewer episodes). And I'll ardently defend Season 5 as well, even though I'd rank it lower on the relative scale. The improved televisual storytelling is one of the reasons that I give it the edge over Season 2, which falls at the bottom of my personal list (though I still think it's great, and I love so many things about it). This is veering into being OT. My apologies. I'll stop now.
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alcasinoroyale
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Post by alcasinoroyale on Aug 8, 2017 19:10:13 GMT -5
This is veering into being OT. My apologies. I'll stop now.
I created a new thread so you guys can continue to discuss it if you want.
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Post by TheArchmaester on Aug 8, 2017 19:12:19 GMT -5
Does anyone else who ventures on reddit's ASOIAF page also feel sometimes that they kind of view the first 4 seasons with rose-tinted glasses and are a little overly nitpicky with current scenes? I personally felt that all 4 of them had no less problems than the newer ones, especially season 2 which was relatively wonky in how it handled two major characters (Jon and Dany). The Night Lands is also perhaps the worse episode the show has done imo. Also while this Loot Train Battle didn't have anyone prominent die, but so didn't Blackwater, but I never saw anyone complain about that. We get clunky scenes sometimes nowadays, but we got just as many in the seasons previous, which is probably bound to happen with something this big being protrayed on screen. I know the majority opinion on this season overall is very positive, but I just don't understand how many there are so convinced that the show is a shell of its former self. I personally think that Seasons 6 and 7 (so far) are up there with the very best of Thrones. Definitely. I don't think there's ever been a drop in quality. Sure, there was unsatisfying stuff in seasons 5 and 6, but it was no different in 1, 2, 3, 4. A series of this scale could never be perfect.
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jared
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Post by jared on Aug 8, 2017 19:15:29 GMT -5
This is veering into being OT. My apologies. I'll stop now.
I created a new thread so you guys can continue to discuss it if you want. Thanks for that, Al! I knew that the Leakbowl thread wasn't the right place to unleash that particular diatribe, but I'd typed it all out before I came to that realization, and it seemed a shame to let it go to waste.
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freypies
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Post by freypies on Aug 8, 2017 19:20:47 GMT -5
This is veering into being OT. My apologies. I'll stop now.
I created a new thread so you guys can continue to discuss it if you want. Thanks Sorry I started that line of discussion in that thread!
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alcasinoroyale
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Post by alcasinoroyale on Aug 8, 2017 19:25:37 GMT -5
Definitely. I don't think there's ever been a drop in quality. Sure, there was unsatisfying stuff in seasons 5 and 6, but it was no different in 1, 2, 3, 4. A series of this scale could never be perfect. I think if S5 didn't have Dorne, there would be a bit more love for it, but compared to other seasons, I think because we saw a lot of the main characters reach their lowest point, it also felt gloomy. S6 we saw a rebirth for most of them after the struggles they faced, almost like building themselves back up from their low points, except for Arya. Maisie even said that it's interesting that Arya reached her lowest point so late in the series compared to other characters. So I also have liked how each season has a different theme in that way.
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Post by Lils on Aug 8, 2017 19:39:28 GMT -5
I feel like people look for any reason to complain. Last season there was nonstop crap about Dany's scenes especially. I think that next season will get more hate as well. People assume that the early were great, but they to forget how much they dragged and how there were filler episodes. I enjoyed them, but I feel like it's gotten so much better since they went their own direction. Season 6 and 7 are my favorites so far.
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Post by TheArchmaester on Aug 8, 2017 19:58:24 GMT -5
Definitely. I don't think there's ever been a drop in quality. Sure, there was unsatisfying stuff in seasons 5 and 6, but it was no different in 1, 2, 3, 4. A series of this scale could never be perfect. I think if S5 didn't have Dorne, there would be a bit more love for it, but compared to other seasons, I think because we saw a lot of the main characters reach their lowest point, it also felt gloomy. S6 we saw a rebirth for most of them after the struggles they faced, almost like building themselves back up from their low points, except for Arya. Maisie even said that it's interesting that Arya reached her lowest point so late in the series compared to other characters. So I also have liked how each season has a different theme in that way. Yeah, season 5 was the darkest point in the story. But that's the way things usually go in the second act. I like it since it gave us some truly game-changing stuff. Revolutions everywhere!
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lordcarson
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Post by lordcarson on Aug 8, 2017 21:13:09 GMT -5
there are certain people in certain places who piss me the fuck off with how nitpicky they are
its a fucking tv show get over yourself and fucking enjoy it you silly motherfuckes
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Post by King Tommen on Aug 8, 2017 23:07:28 GMT -5
The biggest problem with S5 is that it had the thankless task of condensing most of the 2 worst books that had very little in satisfying moments and mainly served to world build and delay payoffs for a story that should have been starting to move toward it's endgame. They did the best they could but as the series was in its infancy, you could tell that AFFC/ADWD crunch was coming eventually and even D&D remarked in S4 that they absolutely dreaded doing the next season because of the overall adaptation problems it presented.
S6 was better because they cleared that signpost and were free to really get into the post-book material.
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Post by archanabrownwalker on Aug 9, 2017 0:52:06 GMT -5
The biggest problem with S5 is that it had the thankless task of condensing most of the 2 worst books that had very little in satisfying moments and mainly served to world build and delay payoffs for a story that should have been starting to move toward it's endgame. They did the best they could but as the series was in its infancy, you could tell that AFFC/ADWD crunch was coming eventually and even D&D remarked in S4 that they absolutely dreaded doing the next season because of the overall adaptation problems it presented. S6 was better because they cleared that signpost and were free to really get into the post-book material. Viewer in me knows you are right. Reader in me rants about cutting out Blackfyre plot, half of Martells, Sarella etc. Heart wants what the heart wants. Pain of not seeing Arianne and Young Griff on screen will not go away.
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Post by nikma on Aug 9, 2017 3:24:02 GMT -5
I remeber how Reddit reacted to S4, so I am really shocked to now see how they are praising that season now. They hated S4 in 2014. Craster's Keep arc, no Tycha, no LSH, "Your sister", Brienne vs Hound, Yara vs Ramsay, they hated Bran's last scene,....
They hated everything that was different from the books. Even then they claimed that D&D are writing LF as an idiot. So when LF was smart in their opinion?
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