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Post by moiaf on May 27, 2017 11:57:19 GMT -5
I'm honestly cool with Jon and dany ruling for the endgame. But I do want the iron throne destroyed. The idea if dany and Jon sharing the throne isn't very appealing to me. I doubt I'm going to get my wish tho. If they're both going to survive then I don't see the iron throne being destroyed That would be so ironic and it would shock people because few expect it. Most people believe it will be destroyed.
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Post by moiaf on May 27, 2017 11:59:44 GMT -5
If this scenario actually happens the frothing at the mouth of some fans will be glorious. There will be an ocean of salty tears. Would the gods be that good to me? lol I'm neutral to jonerys myself. But it's going to be great to see the dany haters get pissed I agree. for me, it's cersei's death I care about the most. As long as her death is fucking amazing and dramatic and emotional. I'll accept almost anything for everything else lol. but logistically with 6 episodes and TV rules and structure... it's 99% likely that jonerys survive imo I'm expecting Cersei to get the death to end all deaths. I mean, like a world class death. D&D love the character and Lena, they will give her something to remember. We'll be talking about it for years. I'm not trying to hype it, I really do think it'll be ironic and epic at the same time.
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Post by nikma on May 27, 2017 12:00:15 GMT -5
I'm honestly cool with Jon and dany ruling for the endgame. But I do want the iron throne destroyed. The idea if dany and Jon sharing the throne isn't very appealing to me. I doubt I'm going to get my wish tho. If they're both going to survive then I don't see the iron throne being destroyed That would be so ironic and it would shock people because few expect it. Most people believe it will be destroyed. And that's the reason why I don't want it destroyed. I'm against that idea that rule of law or state or monarchy are the reason for everything bad that happened in this story. And I don't see how the further destruction of the Seven Kingdoms would solve anything.
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Post by moiaf on May 27, 2017 12:02:18 GMT -5
That would be so ironic and it would shock people because few expect it. Most people believe it will be destroyed. And that's the reason why I don't want it destroyed. I'm against that idea that rule of law or state or monarchy are the reason for everything bad that happened in this story. And I don't see how the further destruction of the Seven Kingdoms would solve anything. My friend is quite sure that the Seven Kingdom will remain as a whole and not splinter. People argue with her all the time about it but she makes a very strong case for it. I wouldn't be surprised. I am expecting King's Landing to be destroyed though.
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Post by Lils on May 27, 2017 12:04:52 GMT -5
And that's the reason why I don't want it destroyed. I'm against that idea that rule of law or state or monarchy are the reason for everything bad that happened in this story. And I don't see how the further destruction of the Seven Kingdoms would solve anything. My friend is quite sure that the Seven Kingdom will remain as a whole and not splinter. People argue with her all the time about it but she makes a very strong case for it. I wouldn't be surprised. I am expecting King's Landing to be destroyed though. What are her arguments? I'd love to hear it because I thought the kingdom would be fractured.
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Post by nikma on May 27, 2017 12:06:42 GMT -5
Unity and creating unity is a strong theme in Jon's arc. I don't see why would he or anyone else decide to destroy the state after the war is over. No one ever said that the existence of the Seven Kingdoms or the Iron Throne are the reasons for misery or death or destruction.
It seems that many people just have that picture in their head like some kind of poetic justice without taking into account what makes sense for the story.
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Post by moiaf on May 27, 2017 12:19:25 GMT -5
My friend is quite sure that the Seven Kingdom will remain as a whole and not splinter. People argue with her all the time about it but she makes a very strong case for it. I wouldn't be surprised. I am expecting King's Landing to be destroyed though. What are her arguments? I'd love to hear it because I thought the kingdom would be fractured. I'll look for them and post them when I find them.
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Post by katjushka on May 27, 2017 12:48:25 GMT -5
Since I don't think that Dany will rule in the end I can't think of a more powerful way for her to die than to convince Jon to kill her to save the world. That would give such a powerful and tragic end to their love that will be remembered forever. I can't think of anything like that in pop culture recently, in any movie or TV show. Sure, that could happen but maaaaan, that would suck so bad. Tragic and rememberable, yes but also real shitty. Also, sacrificing one's self for the sake of love is quite cliche and happens a lot in popculture, maybe not just the way you described it (one begging the other to kill them) but in general it does.
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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2017 16:49:02 GMT -5
My friend is quite sure that the Seven Kingdom will remain as a whole and not splinter. People argue with her all the time about it but she makes a very strong case for it. I wouldn't be surprised. I am expecting King's Landing to be destroyed though. What are her arguments? I'd love to hear it because I thought the kingdom would be fractured. GRRM ranted on his blog after Brexit about how we are better off as larger, more cultural diverse groups of people than smaller, independent and distinct units. Before I saw that, I was on the 'the kingdoms will splinter' train (and I think this would be best, at least for the North), but I departed that train pretty quickly afterwards.
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Post by moiaf on May 27, 2017 17:50:00 GMT -5
What are her arguments? I'd love to hear it because I thought the kingdom would be fractured. GRRM ranted on his blog after Brexit about how we are better off as larger, more cultural diverse groups of people than smaller, independent and distinct units. Before I saw that, I was on the 'the kingdoms will splinter' train (and I think this would be best, at least for the North), but I departed that train pretty quickly afterwards. It was something similar to this that she mentioned. GRRM actually be,ieves in unity. This doesn't mean that the actual Iron Throne will still exist but there is a good chance something will replace but the Seven Kingdoms will remain the Seven Kingdoms. LilsThis is what my friend wrote to me once about this:
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Post by Lils on May 27, 2017 19:09:42 GMT -5
GRRM ranted on his blog after Brexit about how we are better off as larger, more cultural diverse groups of people than smaller, independent and distinct units. Before I saw that, I was on the 'the kingdoms will splinter' train (and I think this would be best, at least for the North), but I departed that train pretty quickly afterwards. It was something similar to this that she mentioned. GRRM actually be,ieves in unity. This doesn't mean that the actual Iron Throne will still exist but there is a good chance something will replace but the Seven Kingdoms will remain the Seven Kingdoms. Lils This is what my friend wrote to me once about this: It would go back to how GRRM presents war as a negative thing. For the ending to go back to how the world was before Aegon, I just can't see GRRM wanting to do that. I think that it's more likely that magic will leave the world, meaning the direwolves, the dragons, and possibly Bran will be gone.
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Post by moiaf on May 29, 2017 6:29:35 GMT -5
Well, if it has nothing to do with Jaime then it's definitely another parallel with Dany. This season is suppose to parallel / contrast these two queens. That they are doing it this late in the season means they want us to focus on it and have it from and center in our minds for when Dany and Jon conceive. Dany can ride Drogon well into pregnancy. You forget season one Dany who rode right up to the day she gave birth. It's a whole Dothraki cultural thing behind that. So, I would say Dany could easily ride Drogon at least until she's six month pregnant. We might see her get a saddle. ETA: She might not even know she's pregnant for months. Let's just agree to disagree lol In thinking about it more, it's hard to imagine she'll be pregnant for most of next season, baring a time jump . Although, I'm sure in season 7 we are suppose to see the parallels and contrast between Cersei and Dany perhaps the parallel/contrast is that at the end of next season Dany will give birth in contrast to Cersei miscarriage at the end of this season. I love speculating about season 8 when we haven't even watched season 7.
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Post by belle on May 29, 2017 10:52:17 GMT -5
Let's just agree to disagree lol In thinking about it more, it's hard to imagine she'll be pregnant for most of next season, baring a time jump . Although, I'm sure in season 7 we are suppose to see the parallels and contrast between Cersei and Dany perhaps the parallel/contrast is that at the end of next season Dany will give birth in contrast to Cersei miscarriage at the end of this season. I love speculating about season 8 when we haven't even watched season 7. since we've known the main points of season 7 since october. the wait for season 8 seems even longer than it actually is lol. thats why i'm hoping we get season 8 leaks this fall. so the wait for season 8 doesn't feel like its 2 years long. talking about dany/cersei parallels......i was wondering if dany might end up paralleling cersei in regards to her emotional state with the 3 dragons dying. we know from the season 7 leaks, that dany is absolutely devastated by viserion's death in the same way that cersei's was for joffrey's death. i believe that rhaegal and drogon will die in season 8. so i wonder if dany will parallel cersei when rhaegal and drogon die. basically that she'll be heartbroken during rhaegal's death but not as viscerally devastated in the same way that cersei was when myrcella died. and then when drogon dies, she won't have that much of a reaction at all like cersei didn't really react when tommen died. the difference here would be though that dany will likely see drogon as important sacrifice to save humanity while cersei accepted tommen's death as a sacrifice to get rid of her enemies and an inevitable part of her fate because of the prophecy.
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Post by moiaf on May 29, 2017 11:01:18 GMT -5
In thinking about it more, it's hard to imagine she'll be pregnant for most of next season, baring a time jump . Although, I'm sure in season 7 we are suppose to see the parallels and contrast between Cersei and Dany perhaps the parallel/contrast is that at the end of next season Dany will give birth in contrast to Cersei miscarriage at the end of this season. I love speculating about season 8 when we haven't even watched season 7. since we've known the main points of season 7 since october. the wait for season 8 seems even longer than it actually is lol. thats why i'm hoping we get season 8 leaks this fall. so the wait for season 8 doesn't feel like its 2 years long. talking about dany/cersei parallels......i was wondering if dany might end up paralleling cersei in regards to her emotional state with the 3 dragons dying. we know from the season 7 leaks, that dany is absolutely devastated by viserion's death in the same way that cersei's was for joffrey's death. i believe that rhaegal and drogon will die in season 8. so i wonder if dany will parallel cersei when rhaegal and drogon die. basically that she'll be heartbroken during rhaegal's death but not as viscerally devastated in the same way that cersei was when myrcella died. and then when drogon dies, she won't have that much of a reaction at all like cersei didn't really react when tommen died. the difference here would be though that dany will likely see drogon as important sacrifice to save humanity while cersei accepted tommen's death as a sacrifice to get rid of her enemies and an inevitable part of her fate because of the prophecy. So, I've believed for a while now that Dany will willingly sacrifice Drogon in order to save humanity. Dany and Cersei are meant to contrast each more than parallel which is why at the end of this season one chooses to give up her pursuit of the throne while the other continues to hold on to it in spite of the impending apocalypse. Dany has suffered a shit ton of loses in her life much more than Cersei and they've made her stronger and more willing to help others who have suffered like her. If anything Dany having a child in the end will be her reward for all her sacrifices.
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Post by belle on May 29, 2017 11:13:19 GMT -5
since we've known the main points of season 7 since october. the wait for season 8 seems even longer than it actually is lol. thats why i'm hoping we get season 8 leaks this fall. so the wait for season 8 doesn't feel like its 2 years long. talking about dany/cersei parallels......i was wondering if dany might end up paralleling cersei in regards to her emotional state with the 3 dragons dying. we know from the season 7 leaks, that dany is absolutely devastated by viserion's death in the same way that cersei's was for joffrey's death. i believe that rhaegal and drogon will die in season 8. so i wonder if dany will parallel cersei when rhaegal and drogon die. basically that she'll be heartbroken during rhaegal's death but not as viscerally devastated in the same way that cersei was when myrcella died. and then when drogon dies, she won't have that much of a reaction at all like cersei didn't really react when tommen died. the difference here would be though that dany will likely see drogon as important sacrifice to save humanity while cersei accepted tommen's death as a sacrifice to get rid of her enemies and an inevitable part of her fate because of the prophecy. So, I've believed for a while now that Dany will willingly sacrifice Drogon in order to save humanity. Dany and Cersei are meant to contrast each more than parallel which is why at the end of this season one chooses to give up her pursuit of the throne while the other continues to hold on to it in spite of the impending apocalypse. Dany has suffered a shit ton of loses in her life much more than Cersei and they've made her stronger and more willing to help others who have suffered like her. If anything Dany having a child in the end will be her reward for all her sacrifices. I know that Dany had to suffer by not having a home and running away during her childhood but tbh I really hate discussions about which character have "suffered" more. especially since cersei is also a rape survivor like dany, and also lost her mother at a young age like dany. i guess dany and cersei's hardships can be somewhat contrasted in the way of sansa and arya. like sansa, at least cersei had a bed to sleep in unlike dany and arya during their childhoods. but it doesn't feel right to say that cersei had it so much easier than dany when she was raped by robert countless times during their marriage. BUT I do agree that Dany's hardships have made her a philanthrope while Cersei's hardships have made her a misanthrope. And thats very clearly emphasized at the end of season 7 i agree. and agreed that dany having a child at the end can be seen as a reward for her. i just think dany's emotional state when losing drogon can parallel cersei's emotional state while losing tommen WHILE having contrasting motivations. and thats so so interesting.
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