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Post by moiaf on Mar 6, 2019 10:24:40 GMT -5
I know that the general fandom has been clinging to the word "bittersweet" for ages now, and many of them assuming that this means there really can't be a happy ending for Dany and/or Jon. To me, these are the two characters who have suffered the most through this story - while consistently working for the betterment of others, not themselves. They are the most selfless of all the characters. For this reason alone, I am convinced they both will live in the end and remain together. Killing off one or the other is literally "overkill"....at this point, having one or both make the ultimate sacrifice (one of whom already has) when they've already sacrificed so much cheapens this story. I think they will be the sweet, not the bitter - which will be that so many of those around them will be the ones to sacrifice themselves for them to bring hope to the future. Yesterdays trailer only reinforced my feelings on this. And every time I hear one of the actors say something like "some will hate it some will love it" with the ending, I think of all the people who can't get past the incest (it's fiction ding dongs) as the ones who will hate it and I just laugh to myself. I agree with all of this and would add that Dany's pregnancy is another indication to me that they survive, that child will be part of the Dream of Spring. Jon and Dany's story are now intrinsically ties together and I can't see one dying and the other surviving, either they both die or they both survive and Jon's already died. If you think about it, it's the perfect "sweet" because it's not quite a fairy tale. Aside from everything they both have been through they are still related so, there's complications. I'm more sure everyday that they both survive.
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Post by StarkL on Mar 6, 2019 11:34:32 GMT -5
we got so much content that I can't help and feel afraid for their destiny. I want the babies, happiness for both.
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Post by Maesteress on Mar 6, 2019 14:32:39 GMT -5
What are the chances, do you think, that we see a wedding? If she is pregnant like everyone assumes, Jon will no way allow the child to be a bastard...do we end up with a quicky under the weirwood tree or an actual finale style wedding? I watched Colbert's interview with Kit yesterday ( here ) and Kit says that (yeah yeah, I know take everything they say with a grain of salt, but...) he could not have predicted the ending and also that everything Rose Leslie has guessed so far about the ending is wrong. So many questions.
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Post by milyagaryen on Mar 6, 2019 16:17:22 GMT -5
Not sure that it means anything, but Dany and Jon seem to be wearing the same outfits in the crypts as in the scene with the dragons...a way of reconciling perhaps?
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Post by Envie on Mar 6, 2019 17:57:31 GMT -5
Not sure that it means anything, but Dany and Jon seem to be wearing the same outfits in the crypts as in the scene with the dragons...a way of reconciling perhaps? I'm thinking that as Maesteress put it so well in one of the speculation threads, Daenerys is going to take a much softer approach to how she communicates with Jon as he struggles with this obvious identity crisis. They clearly are not going to have much time to really unravel the whole problem. The scene we see a flash of in the crypts is probably where Jon's coming to grips with this reality and is upset/brooding over it and she's approaching him cautiously, quietly and with patience - until he's ready to talk about it. Seeing them in the same costumes going towards the dragons doesn't mean it's immediately after that scene but definitely seems to tie it together and indicate that Jon's accepted who he is and moving forward. He *has* to move forward, there's no going back and he needs to work with Daenerys on their mission to save Westeros. Her taking him to meet Rhaegal could be a great way to not only gently move him towards his Targaryen heritage, but also give him the confidence to fight alongside them or even ride Rhaegal into battle against The Night King. With BOTH of them mounted on dragons, they have a much better chance against The Night King on undead Viserion. I think they definitely reconcile in order to move forward with defending their people ... there's just no way they can allow this setback of his identity to stop that.
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Post by StarkL on Mar 26, 2019 5:39:11 GMT -5
So... From what we've gotten from this season, I guess Dany/Jon will play the "us against the world" cliché in the show.
Like, I don't see anyone rooting for them and then there's parentage reveal... I can't wait to see how this will be solved between them.
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Post by Envie on Mar 26, 2019 7:55:36 GMT -5
So... From what we've gotten from this season, I guess Dany/Jon will play the "us against the world" cliché in the show. Like, I don't see anyone rooting for them and then there's parentage reveal... I can't wait to see how this will be solved between them. Jon's parentage is definitely going to throw a monkey wrench into things, but honestly, this "us against the world" thing seems to be overblown right now with some comments made by Maisie in an interview. It shouldn't be a surprise to anyone that Daenerys coming north with Jon, not just as his ally but as his lover/Queen is going to cause a lot of ruffled feathers. This is the drama they foreshadowed in Season 7, first between Jon and Sansa not agreeing on everything, and then between Jon and Daenerys ... until he both fell in love with her and began to see her for the great leader and warrior she is as well. Now that same scenario is going to play out when they arrive as a couple in Winterfell. This is necessary setup plot for the bigger picture, which is, ultimately, that it does not matter. The bigger problem is "us against the undead" ... and US will be everyone. Even Jon's shocking parentage reveal won't mean anything. As Davos so eloquently put it: "It won't matter whose skeleton is sitting on the iron throne."
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Post by sercreighton on Mar 28, 2019 18:16:01 GMT -5
So... From what we've gotten from this season, I guess Dany/Jon will play the "us against the world" cliché in the show. Like, I don't see anyone rooting for them and then there's parentage reveal... I can't wait to see how this will be solved between them. Jon's parentage is definitely going to throw a monkey wrench into things, but honestly, this "us against the world" thing seems to be overblown right now with some comments made by Maisie in an interview. It shouldn't be a surprise to anyone that Daenerys coming north with Jon, not just as his ally but as his lover/Queen is going to cause a lot of ruffled feathers. This is the drama they foreshadowed in Season 7, first between Jon and Sansa not agreeing on everything, and then between Jon and Daenerys ... until he both fell in love with her and began to see her for the great leader and warrior she is as well. Now that same scenario is going to play out when they arrive as a couple in Winterfell. This is necessary setup plot for the bigger picture, which is, ultimately, that it does not matter. The bigger problem is "us against the undead" ... and US will be everyone. Even Jon's shocking parentage reveal won't mean anything. As Davos so eloquently put it: "It won't matter whose skeleton is sitting on the iron throne." I think it's a problem nobody needs or has time to deal with right now, and that may resolve itself by the end of the season. I figure Sam brings it to him in episode one. Then if Jon shares it, that will be with Dany and maybe only her. At some point between 1-2 I think magic Dragon ride. Could be just preparing for the NK, or it could be her trying to help him with his new heritage. Once 3 starts it's unlikely they have time to settle this till 6 maybe 5. It can be settled many ways, Targ love, Just friends, one of them dies, both of them die, Targ hate civil war. I think Dany takes it hard while Jon broods. Ithink Targ hate is probably of the table. But you never know. At some point you gotta think Jon and Dany call bullshit on the universe. We go through all this shit, we lead the fight to save the world, can we have a little damn happiness already. Its a little over the top with the plot twists, life is tough but it ain't pointless. Martin has kinda beaten the surprise your fucked plot twist to death. Look how far he had to go with this one.
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Post by Envie on Mar 28, 2019 18:46:36 GMT -5
We go through all this shit, we lead the fight to save the world, can we have a little damn happiness already. Its a little over the top with the plot twists, life is tough but it ain't pointless. Martin has kinda beaten the surprise your fucked plot twist to death. Look how far he had to go with this one. I agree with this, enough is enough! I was watching some reaction videos posted this past year by folks who didn't follow the show before and were talked into it before the big ending. A cute couple who ends up (unsurprisingly) shipping Dany and Jon long before the big reveals. The woman in the couple is very soft-hearted and doesn't like animals or kids to get hurt (oh boy I was worried she wouldn't last) ... but she has stuck it out. She made a good point that by this time (Season 7 ending) there should be something to hope for but nope, the wall goes down and everyone's headed for sure death. She says she understands why everyone loves the show so much but it's an odd story to love considering how much heartbreak it has in it. She has given up on a 'happy ending' for Jon and Daenerys. All of the actors are sending similar messages (which I think they were coached by the show writers to use) that the ending is brilliant but will not make everyone happy. That's such a wildcard. I said in another post that even a fairytale happy ending with both Jon and Daenerys surviving and leading Westeros to a new age after defeating the White Walkers would not be the ending many want. It's Game of Thrones after all... it should, therefore, have some sort of sad ending in their minds. GRRM's tag word 'bittersweet' gets bantered around so much I don't think we have any idea what that's supposed to mean anymore. Most seem to think there's far more bitter than sweet. I hope it's as brilliant as they say and a good mix of both. So far the story has not disappointed me. I'm definitely not placing any bets on Jon or Daenerys both surviving the end, however.
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Post by sercreighton on Mar 28, 2019 23:59:31 GMT -5
We go through all this shit, we lead the fight to save the world, can we have a little damn happiness already. Its a little over the top with the plot twists, life is tough but it ain't pointless. Martin has kinda beaten the surprise your fucked plot twist to death. Look how far he had to go with this one. I agree with this, enough is enough! I was watching some reaction videos posted this past year by folks who didn't follow the show before and were talked into it before the big ending. A cute couple who ends up (unsurprisingly) shipping Dany and Jon long before the big reveals. The woman in the couple is very soft-hearted and doesn't like animals or kids to get hurt (oh boy I was worried she wouldn't last) ... but she has stuck it out. She made a good point that by this time (Season 7 ending) there should be something to hope for but nope, the wall goes down and everyone's headed for sure death. She says she understands why everyone loves the show so much but it's an odd story to love considering how much heartbreak it has in it. She has given up on a 'happy ending' for Jon and Daenerys. All of the actors are sending similar messages (which I think they were coached by the show writers to use) that the ending is brilliant but will not make everyone happy. That's such a wildcard. I said in another post that even a fairytale happy ending with both Jon and Daenerys surviving and leading Westeros to a new age after defeating the White Walkers would not be the ending many want. It's Game of Thrones after all... it should, therefore, have some sort of sad ending in their minds. GRRM's tag word 'bittersweet' gets bantered around so much I don't think we have any idea what that's supposed to mean anymore. Most seem to think there's far more bitter than sweet. I hope it's as brilliant as they say and a good mix of both. So far the story has not disappointed me. I'm definitely not placing any bets on Jon or Daenerys both surviving the end, however. Brilliant? You can't trust British people with that word. Cup of Tea? Brilliant. Toast? That would be brilliant. They say it about everything. Well I think I can say this, there will be a payoff. Martin might make a reader wait for it, but there is usually a payoff. The characters generally have to earn it, but through all the shit they usually get something. Some good some bad. The red wedding was a payoff, not what many expected but it was one. But the Drogo's funeral pyre was also payoff. First time Dany rides a dragon is in book 5. We had to wait for that shit but there you have it. Jon and Dany meet? Payoff. Some take years some take chapters. Astapor, dude spent the book just dog piling the slavers on the reader. And then? Pay off, show too everyone got goosebumps and shit when Dany was like Valyrian is my fucking language bitch. Battle of the bastards, Winterfell returns to house Stark. Made you wait for it. Some people are gonna make it some won't. Jon and Dany may die, they may live, they may not be together, but that don't mean they can't be happy. It was a bit of a dick move to make them related. It serves little purpose other than to drive a wedge between them, which is just more drama in an ending that is overloaded with drama. If they were not related then we would probably be even more worried they die or one of them dies.
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moiaf
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Post by moiaf on Mar 30, 2019 20:13:40 GMT -5
I’ll write more later but I’m sticking to my guns Jon and Dany live to raise their child and find happiness in each other. Only the actual ending can disuade me of this.
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Envie
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Post by Envie on Apr 3, 2019 16:46:28 GMT -5
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Post by charliexcx on Apr 15, 2019 19:46:00 GMT -5
I forgot about this forum. Glad to see it's still active.
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Post by charliexcx on Apr 15, 2019 19:47:20 GMT -5
What did we think about their scenes in 8x1? I thought they were super cute. I loved the dragon flying scene.
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moiaf
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Post by moiaf on Apr 15, 2019 20:06:08 GMT -5
What did we think about their scenes in 8x1? I thought they were super cute. I loved the dragon flying scene. The dragon riding scene was a bit corny but cute. I thought Jon and Dany were very adorable together, you can tell how comfortable they are with one another. I do want to note that the framing of their shots followed a similar pattern as the end of last season where Jon and Dany are seen isolated even though there are people all around them.
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